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How-to & FAQ for holding Bitcoin and Ethereum in an RRSP/TFSA
submitted by Bastiat to BitcoinCA [link] [comments]
A few months ago I came across a way to hold crypto in my RRSP/TFSA and have been answering questions about how to do that in comments, DM's, and Skype consults. I figured it would be helpful to put together one big comprehensive FAQ. Cryptocurrency is treated as a commodity by the CRA and you must pay capital gains taxes on any profits if held outside a TFSA. If bitcoin goes to $1m as some are predicting, the Canadian government is going to be taxing a huge windfall in capital gains taxes. BACKGROUND
Bitcoin & other crypto cannot be held directly in a RRSP/TFSA, and there are no eligible ETF's in North America yet. However, the ETN COINXBT which trades on the Stockholm Stock Exchange in Sweden (Nasdaq Stockholm) is eligible. ABOUT COINXBT
COINXBT holds bitcoin directly and its price per share is based on a 0.005 multiple of the current bitcoin price.
For example, if the current price of bitcoin is $10000USD, a share of COINXBT will be worth $50USD (ie: $493 Swedish Kroner)
Company's website and full prospectus at: https://xbtprovider.com/
Price quote / chart: https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/COINXBT:SS HOW-TO TRADE
Only some Canadian brokerages allow you to trade on eligible international exchanges in your TFSA. Some do not.
Typically placing trades on international exchanges online is not an option and must be made over the phone broker-assisted at a much higher cost than typical North American securities. CANADIAN BROKERS
I've called pretty much every brokerage to inquire if international securities can be held in a TFSA and what the fee is to transact. You may want to call yourself to see if policies have changed, but here's a summary:
- National Bank: $75 per trade + $0.06 per share (confirmed works)
- TD: Fee dependent on amount traded. Up to $5K is $187, $80K would be $520 per trade (confirmed works)
- CIBC: $250 minimum, based on trade amount. $50K would be about $350 to buy and $350 to sell (confirmed works)
- Scotia iTrade: $250 CAD per trade CAD, unlimited shares & order size (should work)
- BMO Investorline: Fee-based on total trade amount. $50K would be $325 to buy $225 to sell, $50-$60K would be $350 to buy $240 to sell (should work)
Not available, or not available in RRSP/TFSA:
- Interactive Brokers, can trade it, but not in RRSP/TFSA
- Royal Bank
- Credential Direct
- HSBC (has access to almost every exchange other than Stockholm)
- Virtual Brokers
Are you sure it's legal? I'm quite sure it's illegal.
Who is your broker? CAD account?
How do I make a trade once I'm ready?
- I used National Bank Direct Brokerage. The fee's came out to $75 per trade + $0.06 per share.
For example, the commission for a trade I did for 885 shares of COINXBT was $75 + $53.10 for a total of $128.10. Canadian funds were used to make the purchase and there were no forex fees for converting to Swedish Kroner (SEK)
How do I calculate the number of shares to trade to max out my TFSA?
- Call your brokerage and say you want to place a trade on the Stockholm stock exchange. You may be forwarded to a person that specializes in that, and eventually to a broker that deals with placing order on international exchanges. Tell them the symbol to trade is COINXBT and the name of the ETN is "Bitcoin Tracker One".
Market or Limit order?
- The price of COINXBT is in SEK. In my case using NB I took my balance minus anticipated fees divided by the current price to see how many shares I could buy.
For example: For a $10,000 TFSA, current COINXBT price = $554.77SEK (84.27CAD), would be 117 shares at a cost of $9859.59 + $82.02 commission for a total of $9941.61CAD
When can I trade? Is it only possible to make the trade while the Swedish market is open and the TSX are open at the same time? Or can you place the order at any time of day?
- The first time I placed an order for COINXBT I tried to place a limit order a little below the market price. Over the next week the price of bitcoin ran up a lot and didn't come down. I ended up buying a lot higher. Since then I've been placing limit orders slightly above the current price or just market orders so that they go through right away. I've had no issues doing it either way.
Which number did you use to contact the brokerages?
What happens when there is a fork?
What about other cryptocurrencies?
- XBT Provider has said they will monitor forks for 3-months and then decide what action to take. In the case of Bitcoin Cash, they sold the forked coins and distributed it as a dividend to anyone that held ETN shares on the fork date.
How is the price of COINXBT determined?
- An ethereum ETN was recently launched: COINETH that also trades on the Stockholm exchange. https://www.bloomberg.com/quote/COINETH:SS
Other than that, I am not aware of any other eligible crypto securities that can be held in a RRSP/TFSA
Why not just buy GBTC?
- It's based on the average price of the top 3 exchanges
Why can't I place a trade online myself?
- GBTC is traded on the OTC exchange in the US and is not RRSP/TFSA eligible
- For now, there are no crypto ETF's on North American exchanges. They have been in the works for years in the US, but no approvals yet. Evolve funds recently said they plan to launch a Canadian Bitcoin ETF.
Trading COINXBT is a bit of a hassle, but you're getting in ahead of everyone else that are not willing to put in the time/effort.
Once the Canadian/US ETF launches, it will probably be worth it to sell COINXBT and switch to the North American one which should be easy to trade online just like other ETF's.
If you've managed to get crypto into your RRSP/TFSA in any other ways than listed above please do leave a comment and I'll update the post. Thanks!
Sidebar Navigation (Expanded form)
submitted by vekula to CanadianInvestor [link] [comments]
Welcome to /CanadianInvestor
This is the expanded version
of the sidebar to further explain some of the features of these links >Resources
- Standard websites used for investment products besides Mutual Funds
- TMX Money - Used for stock ticker quotes. has news on the front page as well as index performances. contains top market movers by volume and currency/commodity prices. this website is good for looking up tickers and viewing their valuations, graphs, news, location of headquarters and the tickers home website.
- Currency Exchange - This is the Canadian Forex website where we can check out performance of currency for day to day reference
- Montreal Exchange (options/futures) - Options and futures - Montreal Exchange (Wiki)
- CSE - Canadian Securities Exchange - Also not part of the TSX, this stock exchange is for entrepreneurial investments in smaller cap ventures. these companies don't meet TSX listing requirements. CSE (Wiki)
American investing subreddits /Investing
, /Stockmarket >ETF's
- Exchange Traded Funds (Wiki) TSX ETF List
- All Canadian ETF's listed on the Toronto Stock Exchange (Wiki)
- Guggenheim ETFs - A US ETF company which has US dollar ETF's with alternative strategies to the US market (subject to withholding tax unless held in an RRSP) Average MER (Wiki) 0.40%
- BMO ETFs - Bank of Montreal listed ETFs. average MER 0.55%
- IShares - By Blackrock. A large provider of ETF's which operates the largest ETF in canada, XIU (TSX60 (Wiki))
- Vanguard ETFs - usually used for index etf investing. Total market US ETF
- Horizons ETFs - Actively managed ETF's, Alpha and Betapro ETF's
- RBC ETFs - requires some navigation but offers ticker symbols for their variety of broad based etfs. they also have dividend leader etfs
- Questrade ETFs - dont be fooled by the name. they may have different alternative approaches to your investment needs in these ETFs
- First Asset - provides index and alternative investment ETFs
- MarketWatch - New York Stock Exchange news
- Bloomberg - Market news
- BNN - Owned by Bell Canada, this news outlet gives a day to day on the canadian market
- CME Group - commodity live feed of futures >Analyst Opinions
- Educated guesses or factual information
>Forums >Definitions Finance - Common Terms
- Morningstar - Stock analyst - Upgrades and Downgrades
- Stockchase - Could give you good or bad reasons to buy a specific stock from an educated perspective. like anything on the internet, it cant be taken seriously but it might shine light on something you may have not known about
- This has every term you need to know about finance >Couch Potato Beginner Fundamental Index Investing
- the go to strategy for setting up a starting portfolio to gain the average market performance >DRIP Dividend Reinvestment Explained
- dripprimer.ca which explains dividend investing. whole shares are only able to be reinvested unless you are enrolled privately through a company agreement to have partial shares reinvested >Risk in Stocks Understanding your risk
- common question in market exposure is sometimes how exposed do you want to be and what is comfortable for your situation. your tolerance level. www.getsmarteraboutmoney.ca
has other investment ideas for planning purposes >TFSA Info Canada Revenue Agency
- common Q/A on TFSA's answered which should provide the information you need on withdrawing and contribution limits >Foreign Tax Withholding Tax
- US listed companies or investment products (etfs) are subject to withholding tax unless they are held in an RRSP. this explains foreign withholding tax and what it means for your investments. >SEDAR Legal Financial Statements
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